Supernatural TalkTarts talk about Supernatural 5.10: Abandon All Hope...
Welcome to Supernatural Talk, where Tarts talk about Supernatural, their favourite show about demon-hunting brothers. This week: episode 5.10: "Abandon All Hope..." Sam and Dean come to an understanding with Crowley over the Colt, then head down to Carthage, Missouri to hunt down the devil alongside Castiel, Jo and Ellen. The streets have been taken over by reapers, hellhounds and Meg. Jo and Ellen make the ultimate sacrifice as Castiel plants Doubt (to steal a usage from Terry Pratchett and Neil Gaiman) in Meg's faith in Lucifer, and Sam and Dean take on Satan himself. The brothers fail, allowing Lucifer to raise Death itself.
Patti Martinson, Staff Writer: I think the events of this episode are a complete embodiment of the title "Abandon All Hope". Ellen and Jo's actions are pretty much what Sam and Dean have done. They're smart people who will willingly sacrifice themselves. I also think that their deaths were intended to remove all hope that Sam and Dean can succeed in their rebellion and move them that much closer to being meatsuits for Lucifer and Michael. Katherine Keller, Culture Vultures Editrix: I think that one of the themes of the show regarding hunters is that one way or another, they will sacrifice everything to the cause, voluntarily or involuntarily. In the end, literally or figuratively, you will give your life for your fellow man. As for Bobby, he's in that chair because of the sacrifice every hunter makes, and he certainly lost his old life. Dean in Bobby's chair? Things change, people change. Dean may be called to give up things he loves and change his life completely for the greater good. Suzette Chan, Columns Editrix: There seem to be two kinds of hunters: lone wolves like Rufus, Gordon and Kubrick, and families like the Winchesters and the Harvelles. The lone wolves give up family lives and personal lives for the hunt. These individuals are represented as being out of touch with humanity to different degrees. Rufus is a hermit, Gordon was maximally obsessed and Kubrick was a mystic. The families will give up anything for the hunt — except family, sometimes to the detriment of the hunt. The Winchesters have a habit of letting their selfish love of each other complicate their war against the demons. Mary, John and Dean all made deals to save other members of the family, and Sam couldn't bring himself to kill the Yellow-Eyed Demon while it possessed John. But the Harvelles managed to keep their family together while giving up everything for the hunt. Bill Harvelle died while on a hunt (with John), but there's no indication that Ellen was even tempted to make a deal to bring her husband back. In this episode, she and Jo go out as a family, defiant to the end. What was really amazing about Jo and Ellen as characters is that we continued to see more depth to them right up to their deaths. Jo has obviously grown into a hunter in her own right, infiltrating Crowley's estate, taking her fate into her own hands and drawing up the plan at the end. Ellen also grows, moving from overprotective mom to co-hunter, even if that came at the last moment. Ellen's decision to be with Jo was not just out of love or sentiment. She was also being pragmatic. If she hadn't been with Jo, no one would have been there to press the detonator. So the Harvelle women proved to be hard-nosed, hardcore hunters who sacrificed their lives, but not their humanity. Bobby's mentoring of Dean in this episode demonstrated how hunters pass on the mantle. Bobby is Dean's Yoda, which makes me think that Wolfie was right way back in Season 4 when she pointed out that Bobby fits the trope of the mentor who has to die so that his student can become the master. So I'm afraid it doesn't look good for Bobby. Before Carthage, Bobby isn't part of either group of hunters in his house: Ellen, Jo and Castiel in his kitchen drinking or Dean and Sam in his office thinking. Instead, he spends most of the episode wheeling himself under the lintel between the two rooms — between worlds, alone in a transitional space. He is also the third person around Dean in the world's glummest group photo. The other two are Jo and Ellen. Are the people who are closest to Dean in that photo in the most immediate danger? Dean's occupation of Bobby's chair signifies his position as the next senior hunter in the Winchester-Singer "family." Veteran hunters are getting taken out during the Apocalypse, and there's already a generational void left by the deaths of people like John and Mary Winchester and Bill Harvelle (later, Ellen Harvelle), so Dean, as the elder Winchester, has to step up. Scarily, Dean is characteristically cavalier about his own life. As they're talking about ambushing the Devil, he refers to Sam as a valued object (valued by the Devil, but still), while he dismisses himself as a pawn of no value: "You can't come with. I go get Satan and screw the pooch, okay. You know, we've lost a game piece — that we can take. But if you're there, then we are handing the Devil's vessel right over to him." Given Dean's earlier ribbing about Sam's relationship with Ruby, Sam tosses it back, "Haven't we learned a damn thing? If we're going to do this, we're going to do this together," along with deluxe puppy dog eyes. Dean folds like a cheap suit. Later, in Carthage, Dean takes the lead, especially when they confront Meg on the street. But after Jo is injured, Dean, who is usually full of bravado, is unguarded and vulnerable when he's talking to Bobby on the ham radio. He's also in a period of transition, from student to equal. Wolfen Moondaughter, Assistant Reviews Editrix and Den Mother: Jo and Ellen have a great deal of love in them, for each other and for the world. I know this is arguably a Women in Refrigerators thing, but in a way? It isn't. They knew the risks going in, and while it does add a great deal of angst to the boys' story indirectly, at that particular point it was the Harvelles' story and no one else's. They didn't die alone, but they didn't die with the boys, either. They died by the choices they made, and they died heroically for the greater good. I don't think a hunter could ask for more than to go down fighting. Well, except maybe to have won and died in their sleep at a ripe old age with all the monsters gone, but as that probably could never happen — there'll always be some evil down the road — this is the next best thing. I have to say I think it's damn brave — not that fighting a monster isn't brave, but bringing about one's own death rather than it just being a chance ... well, I couldn't do it. But why shouldn't they be allowed to sacrifice themselves as any male character, like John, might choose to? The brothers certainly have done as much before. Granted, the brothers have been brought back, but for one, they have to be, as the lead characters, and secondly, we can't say for sure that the gals won't be. Self-sacrifice is one of the most important themes of the show. Mary's family sacrificed normal lives to be hunters, and, when the time came, so did John and his and Mary's sons. Dean also sacrificed his everyday life, his childhood, to be his brother's protector, and later sacrificed his literal life as well to the same end. Sam momentarily sacrificed his humanity to stop the Apocalypse. Lilith sacrificed her life to bring forth Lucifer. Ruby sacrificed her identity, her status amongst demonkind, for Lucifer. Jimmy sacrificed his body for Castiel. Dean sacrificed his youth for Bobby. Jesse sacrificed his family life for his parents' safety and the welfare of the world (so that he couldn't be used as a weapon). The list is endless, really. For now, Bobby is all the boys have left in the way of family. I fear this means he's not long for this world, that Dean will have to grow up and the boys will have to face the end alone. This makes Dean's aging a few eps back all the more symbolic, as he was, at the time, learning what it means to be an aged hunter from Bobby. Whatever happens, I think this means Dean will survive all this to become the mentor to the next generation of hunters. The bigger question then is what will become of Sam, if it's Dean alone who steps into Bobby's shoes? What role will Sam play in the future? Who, if anyone, is his mentor? Lucifer? Or will Sam go out like his father, whom they say Sam is, deep down, more like than Dean? Suzette: I like all your examples of self-sacrifice, but I think Ruby was a bit different. I agree that she sacrificed her identity — she changed bodies and tactics to influence Sam last season — but I'm not so sure that she made the sacrifice primarily for Lucifer. After Sam killed Lilith, Ruby celebrated two things: (1) explicitly, her awesomeness, and (2) implicitly, her role in bringing Sam unimaginable rewards. So I'd argue that Ruby used Lilith's goal of raising Lucifer to meet her (Ruby's) own personal goal of besting all the demons that put her down. In this way, Ruby went down a parallel road to Sam. Sam had other motivations and would never gloat, but he did have a need to prove himself, and to prove himself to be better than other hunters or members of his own family. Wolfie: Point taken. It was still a sacrifice, though, even if it was for selfish reasons rather than noble ones, as to sacrifice just means to give one thing up for the sake of another. She gave up her current credibility with demonkind and denied herself her demonly urges in the hopes of gaining better status later.
Patti: I definitely got a Spike vibe from Crowley's speech. Happy Meals with Legs. I think they are setting Crowley up as an ally of Sam and Dean at the end. They just might collect an array of unlikely allies at the end. Meg might just be another one, given the seed that was planted in her head by Castiel about Lucifer's indifference to demons. Katherine: I loved Crowley. The casting was so perfect. I loved loved loved how he insisted on sealing the pact with a kiss. But, I don't trust Crowley. He'll lie by telling the absolute truth. Hell, sending Sam and Dean to Carthage certainly played out to Lucifer's advantage. Suzette: After Alastair, Dean's mentor in Hell, Crowley is the second reference this show has made to the sympathetic demon in Good Omens, Aleister Crowley (which in turn referenced the real life occultist of the same name). The biggest tip-off was the footage of the freeway, recalling Good Omens Crowley's opening gambit of tying up traffic as a way to drive humans to do evil. That Crowley and this Crowley clearly delight in the human world, which is their playground. Judging by his behaviour with the banker, Supernatural's Crowley is used to using human frailty to make a world that suits his whims. He's very self-centered, unlike Meg, who believes in the supremacy of Lucifer, but very much like Ruby. It is very telling that when we first see him, Crowley is watching Triumph of the Will, the (in)famous documentary celebrating Hitler's Nazi government. Like the Nazis, Crowley is a "will to power" kind of guy. He's ruthless, but that's not the only thing that gets him results. The Nazis rose to power democratically — you could say they took advantage of a weakness in the electorate or the electoral system (there were too many unstable minority governments in an unstable time before 1932). Crowley is also exploiting a Winchester weakness: their altruism. Sam and Dean want to save humanity from supernatural forces, and Crowley wants to save humanity for himself. This is a perilously fine line on which Crowley and the Winchesters find common ground. Crowley's presence and his cooperation by giving them the Colt means that the Winchesters are once again in a position of working with a demon. Significantly, Sam tries to shoot Crowley at the first opportunity: he's obviously not in the mood to trust demons, as his chat with Dean sets up. Meanwhile, Crowley was testing the Winchesters by "forgetting" to reload the Colt. (Another Sam/Crowley comparison: they each kill two of Crowley's demon henchmen in this episode, but the difference is that Sam had the practical goal of getting past Crowley's defenses; Crowley did it as a grand gesture of power — another Nazi parallel.) The brothers proved to be intelligently suspicious; even though Crowley still thinks they're morons, he has some confidence that they'll at least be able to take the shot. Of course, that's what Crowley says he wants. There's also the possibility that he wants the gun in play for some other reason. Another interesting note about Crowley: in the previous episode, fangirl Becky speculates that Crowley was Bela's lover. This raises the possibility that he was one of Bela's mysterious buyers. He has a well-appointed abode, and clearly values expensive things, like the rug that the Winchesters destroy with the devil's trap. He also has a great motivation to own the kinds of things that Bela stole, items of great supernatural power, such as the Colt. I'm really curious about Meg. She obviously knows Crowley, and her reaction upon hearing his name is complicated. She's also perplexed by Lucifer's order to leave the Winchesters alone, and later bothered by Castiel's insinuations about Lucifer's motives. She's clearly a true believer, but what if her belief is shattered? Will she be convinced to come over to same side as Crowley and the Winchesters? What did Crowley do to upset Meg? What's her demon name? Wolfie: First thing I thought of when we learned this was Crowley was Good Omens. Second thing I thought of was Aleister Crowley of the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn. I'm glad it was the second thing, not the first, because I grew up with a bust of Crowley in my dad's room, and it always creeped me out. *shudder* Third thing I thought of was a memory regarding Mark Sheppard, who plays Crowley. When Sheppard spoke to some friends of mine at MegaCon a couple of years ago, they asked him if he would ever be on Stargate Atlantis, and, according to my friends, he said no, stating that it was lowbrow and he preferred highbrow stories. That rubbed me the wrong way, so it has been difficult for me to watch him since. Still, he is obviously entitled to his opinions and interests, to take the roles that he wants to take, and if my friends have correctly relayed to me what he'd conveyed, then I guess it speaks well of this show that he deigns to be on it. I, too, loved that Crowley's deal was sealed with a kiss. *grin* I wonder if Mr Sheppard sees that as art or as what it more likely is: catering to the slash-lovin' fangirls like myself? Well, I suppose it can work on both levels. I want to trust Crowley, but I wholly recognise that this is because I love the character from Good Omens and therefore don't want him to be bad. Still, it makes sense, from his standpoint, for him to aid the boys. Even so, after all that went down with Ruby, I'm still wary and recognise that there is likely some factor involved that we know nothing about. Even if he does work with them now, it may be an entirely different game once Lucifer is gone. He might even be worse.
Patti: Lucifer seems to be toying with Sam, I don't know precisely why Sam acted the way he did. As far as the Carthage name? I think it would have sounded more familiar and it rhymes a bit with carnage. Katherine: Lucifer clearly chose Carthage because it's the home of the Precious Moments Inspirational Chapel and Park. Delenda est Carthago, indeed. Let the sowing of the fields with salt begin and may no stone stand on top of another when he is through. Yes, Lucifer wants to put his prom dress on — it's right there in front of him! The current one is battered and torn and wearing out. Of course Sam is more than a little angry and freaked about that, because yes, everything Lucifer says to him is true. He felt and still feels that way a lot of the time. Sam also knows that this is the soft-pedal. At some point, Lucifer's going to put the screws to him to say yes. Never has "just say no" been more important. Suzette: Lucifer seemed to be teasing more than anything else. He literally gives Sam a sermon on the mount, talking down to Sam: they aren't even remotely on the same level. Lucifer wants Sam to be angrier, so there might be — no, wait, this is Supernatural — there will be more emotional torture as the seduction of Sam Winchester continues. I found it interesting that Sam takes in a lot of stories from Hell in this episode. When he first hears out Crowley, he is very studious and inquisitive: "But he created you." Yet he's prepared to shoot Crowley the minute his has the Colt in his hand. He's now as cold about killing demons, regardless of the damage to the human meatsuits, in a rational state as he has been when he's out of his mind trying to save Dean (from Casey and her partner in 3.04 "Sin City" and two Crossroads Demons — none of whom was an active threat to his brother). When he listens to Lucifer, Sam is very indignant at first, but Lucifer sounds so reasonable. Why not save himself and the rest of the world a lot of suffering by saying yes now? Ironically, when Lucifer says he needs Sam's rage, Sam retaliates by calming down, withholding that anger from Lucifer. But he gets reeled into a civil discussion with Lucifer about what happened to the other townspeople. This was a chillingly illustration of Lucifer's ability to turn people's psyches against themselves. Sam may think he's resisting the devil, but he's playing into Lucifer's hands just by listening to him. Lucifer spins narratives designed to play up grievances, and to use people's insecurities and ambitions against them (like Iago in Othello ). Earlier, he pointed out the parallels between his rebellion and Castiel's (maybe Raphael was right about the possibility that Lucifer put Castiel back together to have as many rebel angels on his side as possible). To Sam, Lucifer says, "Michael turned on me. Called me a freak. A monster." Those are the exact words that are Sam's greatest nightmare coming from Dean. Carthage was an interesting choice. Going back further than the civil war, the battle at Carthage (in what is now Tunisia) in the year 689 is said to have determined which of the battling Abrahamic religions would dominate the area: Christianity or Islam. So will the Carthage on Supernatural prove to be a milestone in determining who gets to run the world: humans or gods? Wolfie: I figured he had to be serious; his vessel is deteriorating around him! It doesn't look like he has much time left! As for Carthage, my historical and religious knowledge is nil here, so I bow to my sister Tart's expertise and what was said on the show, but I will say it makes me giggle that the town's name is so similar to "carnage".
Patti: At first, I thought it was rampant misogyny to kill off Ellen and Jo, whose deaths proved to be almost meaningless. However, they did save Sam and Dean from the hellhounds. I think Ellen and Jo were doomed when Jo got wounded. They did join Sam and Dean by their own choice and the consequences couldn't have been worse. It was pretty clear that Jo wouldn't survive and people definitely understood that Ellen wouldn't leave her. It also showed that even with such powerful entities such as hellhounds, humans triumph, although at great cost. Their death scenes were the most powerful I've ever seen on the show. I thought initially it was a bit idiotic that they would attempt to use the Colt on Lucifer. I had thought it was meant only for demons and using it on an archangel would be obviously ineffective. However, Castiel didn't seem to be aware that the Colt would be ineffective and they literally had no other weapon that could have been powerful enough to use against Lucifer. I do think it was another example of "abandoning all hope" in that they had faith in the Colt and that was taken away from them. Lucifer stated that the Colt doesn't work on five people or something to that effect. Since he is one of them, I assume the Colt wouldn't work on archangels and God. Which would make sense if the power of the Colt comes from God or the archangels themselves. I also thought it interesting how much contempt Lucifer seems to have towards anyone other than himself. Angels, humans, demons, they appear to mean little to him. The only beings that seem to impress him any are the Horsemen; I really want to see how they will do Death. Katherine: I find it interesting that in Supernatural mythos, Lucifer is the younger brother. I loved Castiel's way of getting out of the circle of flamey flames. I also found Lucifer and Castiel's conversation a little sad and enlightening. Because yes, Castiel is now, technically speaking, a fallen angel. But at the same time, here he is, looking at the person who was once his idolized biggest brother ... who has to stop and think before he remembers Castiel's name. Such an imbalance of power. Suzette: With this episode and 4.16 "On the Head of a Pin," I'm becoming even more fond of Ben Edlund's intense myth arc episodes than his cracktastic ones (though I can't think of anything that can be better than a giant suicidal teddy bear). He gets to play with all the toys in the sandbox, setting up counterpoints among a huge cast of significant Supernatural characters. Kudos also to director Phil Sgriccia, who made this ep look amazing. A litany of examples is strewn in the comments below. Santana for the win! In Carthage, there are signs that read "Anti-God is Anti-Religion" and "Jesus Saves." That's all very ironic considering how jerky the forces of Heaven have been to humans on this show. The scene of Castiel walking amongst all the reapers and the shot that pans from Castiel on the street to Castiel inside the building were creepy and effective. You really got a sense of Castiel's non-humanness. When Lucifer said, "Castiel, right?" he was like a CEO who makes a point of remembering one of his employees' names. The shaky-cam worked really well when they were holed up in the store. Things are fundamentally uncertain for the boys: Jo is dying and they can't fix her, Bobby can't come and save them, Dean doesn't know what to do, Sam doesn't have any comforting words.
Y'know, Jo looks a lot like Mary Winchester. To me, that just reinforces the idea that Dean and Jo had more of a sibling relationship. Sure, he was perving Jo, but he also thought his mom was a babe in 4.03 "In the Beginning." Going back to 1.17 "Hell House", when Sam emerged half-naked from the shower, Dean has given his brother some lingering looks. While this may inspire Wincest, I think canon Dean has an auto-perv response that he just can't help. Bobby, Sam and Dean give Jo and Ellen a hunter's burial in absentia by dropping their "last night on earth" photo into Bobby's fireplace. Wolfie: While I do think it was a noble end for the Harvelles, I am still upset, not just in the sense of caring for the characters that were killed off, but in the sense that I was so happy they had come back in the first place, especially Jo. My shippy little heart is crushed, especially since they revisited the subject of Dean/Jo here! Yeah, yeah, no jeopardy without death, but I still hope maybe they'll be brought back. I know some people see that as negating the nobility of the death, but I say if you don't know you'll be brought back, how can it negate the nobility you have when you give your life in the first place? The intent would still have been there. I did greatly appreciate how much of Castiel there was in this ep. Loved the scene where he was knocking back the shots (although this does seem disturbingly like lead-up to the future Dean saw). I agree 100% with Suzette about the effectiveness of the reaper scene in being creepy and accentuating Castiel's "otherness".
Patti: Apocalyptic? Almost biblical in epic proportion? Katherine: Really arc heavy and getting bleaker. I think that this episode was a real warning that we're dealing with Beowulf here in terms of epics. This is not going to be The Odyssey, which is all about "winning", if you will. Suzette: Like Sam and Dean's relationship, it was a bit rocky, but then regrouped by the end. I understand wanting to keep the Apocalypse in the background, but it's such a compelling story that the stand-alone episodes often paled in comparison to the myth arc-heavy ones. It was too bad Sam and Dean's separation lasted only one episode. It would have been interesting to see how they approached separate cases. It would also have added to the geographic scope of an Apocalypse that is expressing itself in low-level, localized events. But I did appreciate how the writers ensured that Sam and Dean did not miraculously drop all of their differences. Actually, that's the point of being in human society, isn't it? Embracing differences and conflict, in contrast to the Yes Lordism that seems to pervade the angel and demon worlds. We're also seeing a leadership arc for Dean, which I noted in the answer to the second question. For Sam, we're seeing a quiet redemption arc. He's putting his head down and trying to be the best hunter and best brother possible. He has pushed Dean to talk about some of their issues, but he has not been asking for credit for his efforts. Sam's non-showiness in his redemption is as fitting as Dean's understated shift into leadership. Last year, the show introduced angels (not as lame as I thought!); this year, it's developing an alternative Michael-Lucifer narrative that draws as much (if not more) from Vertigo Comics as the bible to suit the show's purposes — hence Lucifer's "little brother" chat with Sam, as I mentioned earlier. While it's causing some mind-bending retcon (why exactly did it have to be Sam and Dean?), it's also a good way to bring both brothers into the myth arc. The new storyline also allows the show to play with the bible as folklore as much as it has other legends and myths. I wonder this kind of bold re-writing of literal biblical canon is inspiring the writers foreground meta-stories such as the "Supernatural" convention and the adventure in TV Land. If Supernatural can do this to the bible, then why the heck not acknowledge that fans do this to Supernatural? Wolfie: Getting down to business. Not that things weren't serious before, but last season was prep, while this is the full-on war itself. Ironically — save for this episode — this season is about gaining hope rather than abandoning it. The brothers were estranged but reunited, Dean finding the strength to forgive Sam and Sam starting to forgive himself. Also, the demons' big weapon turned out to be a dud, Jesse choosing not to bring harm. The boys may have talked Gabriel into being an ally, and Castiel may have done the same with Meg. Crowley may be an ally. The brothers, rather than being influenced by Lucifer and Michael, may in fact influence those angels, and defy the story the angels are so set on seeing play out. Really, all they have to do is refuse to kill each other, even if they get possessed. I think there's more hope now than there was at the end of the last season.
Patti: We have War and Death. I presume that Pestilence and Famine are not long afterwards. I would like to see the Horsemen turn on Lucifer, since it appears that their entire existence depends on humans surviving. What would be the point of the Horsemen if their main victims were all gone? I think Crowley might be spot on. If demons suddenly start realizing Lucifer isn't really on their side, that would change the whole nature of the battle. Katherine: I would like to see Gabriel pull of a tricksteriffic deus ex machina that results in a hilarious comeuppance for Lucifer. (I would also love the backstory on Gabriel and his vessel — what was that sales pitch like?) I'd like to see Chuck's archangel take a body, too. I'm half waiting for the Holy Grail to show up, or the Spear of Destiny. I also wonder if Michael is circling his secondary vessel, or will he wait until Dean says yes, or until Lucifer burns out his current one. I find it very interesting that he hasn't taken the field yet. I'd also like to see what the shapeshifters, werewolves and vampires think of the Apocalypse. Do they have an agenda? Suzette: I'd like to know what five things the gun can't kill! Lucifer is one. What else? 4 - Michael? 3 - God? 2 - Death? or Sam? 1 - Jesse? or Dean? Both Zachariah and Lucifer say that Sam will say yes in six months, which puts it around, oh, season finale time! Between now and then, I'd like to see some indication that the Winchesters have shaken down Castiel for all the angel intel he has, and figure out how to prevent the ineffable double possession. Also, they need to school themselves about Michael. Where is he? In what form is he? How will he make himself known? How can they defend themselves against him? Actually, these are things that Castiel probably doesn't know, so there is a lot of room for suspense and surprises. Wouldn't it be ironic if Sam says yes to Lucifer because Dean said yes to Michael first? Speaking of Castiel, I'd like to see some more exploration of his finding himself in the material world with no way out. His situation parallels Sam and Dean's, who find themselves with a foot into the spiritual world with no clue how to disengage themselves and, as the late Supernatural director and producer Kim Manners (and Ellen) would say, kick it in the ass. With Sam becoming more independent from Dean, and Dean stepping up to fill his father's shoes, let's see if they can help Michael and Lucifer get over their daddy issues. I figure that's what will save them all in the end. Will Sam and Dean put together a supernatural superteam? They already have Castiel and Crowley (kind of). What about Gabriel, Jesse, Meg or even Patrick the He-Witch? (Belated musing: is Patrick meant to be John Constantine, but with a toothpick instead of a cigarette?) I'd love to see more hunter culture. Does the Apocalypse make them band together? Organize themselves into more self-contained cells? How about rival cells? Will they recruit others? Would some want to go public with the Apocalypse? Do they become hermits? Will they be gunning for Sam, and his brother, even more than before? (I'd love to see a Gordon-like hunter accuse Dean of what Dean can't forgive Sam for: allying with a demon, in this case, the might-as-well-be-a-demon, Sam.) Wolfie: Gabriel and Meg join in the fight, on their side. Crowley helping them. Lots of Castiel. On a more wishful-thinking level, Ellen Muth (Dead Like Me) and/or Bret Harrison (Reaper) as a reaper (or even Death), just for the wink-factor. Pagan gods coming out and telling the angels and demons to knock it off already, as they're trying to sleep. Of course, I want a happy ending, 'cause that's the kind of girl I am.
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